[Women] Women's Group Feb. 10
Annie Warmke
annie at bluerockstation.com
Tue Feb 9 10:47:27 CST 2021
Thanks Melinda McDowell. That's a great idea. I hope a lot of this
kind of thing can be incorporated in to how we move forward from here.
Annie Warmke
On 2/8/2021 10:00 AM, Melinda McDowell via Women wrote:
> I would think that all policies should be in a place that the entire
> community can readily get to them, for example in the congregation
> handbook (if there is one) and the web page. Keeping everything out in
> the open leads to a safer more welcoming community.
>
> Melinda
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Feb 8, 2021, at 9:57 AM, Melinda McDowell
>> <md.mcdowell70 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Feb 8, 2021, at 8:54 AM, Teresa Hayes
>>> <teresa_asselinhayes_2000 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks for sharing this Melinda. I don't know what the current FUUSM
>>> policy is, but if there isn't one in place, there needs to be, This
>>> information is likely all that's necessary to develop a policy
>>> effective for the congregation's needs.
>>>
>>> Is there a board member receiving this e-mail who can take our
>>> concerns to the meeting today? Chris? Kat? Nancy?
>>>
>>> Just a suggestion: Once policy is set, it might be a good course of
>>> action to put the policy in writing and send to the members and
>>> friends of FUUSM. Then there will be no question about acceptable
>>> behavior and what is not acceptable.
>>>
>>> Monday, February 8, 2021, 6:37:02 AM EST, Melinda McDowell via Women
>>> <women at fuusm.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Women mailing list
>>> Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org>
>>>
>>> There is a large amount of information out there concerning making a
>>> congregation safe and examples of Unitarian Universalist sexual
>>> harassment policies. There is no need to reinvent the wheel. I’ve
>>> included links to just a few documents.
>>>
>>> https://www.uua.org/files/documents/haffnerdebra/sex_health_responsible.pdf
>>> <https://www.uua.org/files/documents/haffnerdebra/sex_health_responsible.pdf>
>>>
>>> https://www.uua.org/safe/handbook/sexually-safer-congregations
>>> <https://www.uua.org/safe/handbook/sexually-safer-congregations>
>>>
>>> https://uueugene.org/safe-congregation-procedures/
>>> <https://uueugene.org/safe-congregation-procedures/>
>>>
>>> https://secondunitarian.org/staging/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/Resources-safecongregationspolicy0707.pdf
>>> <https://secondunitarian.org/staging/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/Resources-safecongregationspolicy0707.pdf>
>>>
>>> https://www.sunnyhill.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/UUCSH-Toward-a-Safe-Congregation-Policy.pdf
>>> <https://www.sunnyhill.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/UUCSH-Toward-a-Safe-Congregation-Policy.pdf>
>>>
>>> Melinda
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>> On Feb 7, 2021, at 9:01 PM, robin--- via Women <women at fuusm.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If in fact this information is based on second-hand knowledge, then
>>>> I don't think any action should be taken against anyone. If the man
>>>> who reported this is concerned, perhaps he could encourage one or
>>>> more of the women to talk with Kat or someone from the board about
>>>> it confidentially and then the board could take appropriate
>>>> action. It is unfair to challenge or confront someone without
>>>> information directly from the person injured or harassed or a
>>>> witness to such an event. We could all be supportive of taking
>>>> action if anyone has been harassed.
>>>>
>>>> And, it seems that a sexual harassment policy wouldn't be a bad idea.
>>>>
>>>> Robin
>>>>
>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>> Subject: Re: [Women] Women's Group Feb. 10
>>>> From: Annie Warmke via Women <women at fuusm.org
>>>> <mailto:women at fuusm.org>>
>>>> Date: Sat, February 06, 2021 6:30 pm
>>>> To: amdbone--- via Women <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>>
>>>> Cc: Annie Warmke <annie at bluerockstation.com
>>>> <mailto:annie at bluerockstation.com>>
>>>>
>>>> I outlined the sequence of events starting with July 2019 so I
>>>> think the
>>>> man who brought the information did his due diligence. What has
>>>> become
>>>> obvious is that we need to make sure we have adequate ways to
>>>> address
>>>> sexual harassment, and perhaps even bullying. We perhaps need to
>>>> periodically announce we are a safe space on these issues. We're
>>>> working on something to give to the board to address the
>>>> current issue,
>>>> and future issues...a strategy, if you will. Annie
>>>>
>>>> On 2/6/2021 1:17 PM, amdbone--- via Women wrote:
>>>> > After carefully reading the ongoing onslaught of emails, I
>>>> have to go back to the original statement. A man told me that
>>>> there are 4 women sexually harrassed...does anyone else see a
>>>> problem with this? I think, normally, when hearing this sort of
>>>> gossip, one has to be concerned with both men and the spreading
>>>> of gossip, whether true or not. if this statement by "the man"
>>>> is true, why didn't he take appropriate measures? Again, just
>>>> my opinion, but it sure looks like what is needed might be as
>>>> simple as board accessibility if there are sound concerns with
>>>> facts.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > ---- nancy wolske via Women <women at fuusm.org
>>>> <mailto:women at fuusm.org>> wrote:
>>>> >> The breadth of the conversation continued, so I’m glad Cindy
>>>> spoke up.
>>>> >> The onus is on anyone using email to be aware of to whom
>>>> you’re sending a message, especially so when someone’s being
>>>> accused and named, and especially when the accuser remains
>>>> anonymous and the accusation is hearsay. Much harm can result.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Saturday, February 6, 2021, 12:29 PM, Rebecca Phillips
>>>> via Women <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> #yiv4074534208 P {margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0;}To all: the
>>>> breadth of the conversation was accidental.
>>>> >> "If you have a garden and a library, you have everything you
>>>> need."-- Cicero
>>>> >> From: Women <women-bounces at fuusm.org
>>>> <mailto:women-bounces at fuusm.org>> on behalf of nancy wolske via
>>>> Women <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>>
>>>> >> Sent: Saturday, February 6, 2021 12:18 PM
>>>> >> To: A List for the Women of FUUSM <women at fuusm.org
>>>> <mailto:women at fuusm.org>>
>>>> >> Cc: nancy wolske <nwolske17 at yahoo.com
>>>> <mailto:nwolske17 at yahoo.com>>
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [Women] Women's Group Feb. 10 Absolutely.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Saturday, February 6, 2021, 12:10 PM, Cindy Brown via
>>>> Women <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I'd like to just reiterate Teresa's earlier email - this
>>>> conversation really should not be taking place on such a large
>>>> list. I'm quite uncomfortable with this knowledge that I have
>>>> no right to possess.
>>>> >> ThanksCindy
>>>> >> On Sat, Feb 6, 2021 at 11:55 AM Chris via Women
>>>> <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I did not know this about Paul Dunn. I do not know the names
>>>> of the women he harassed before he left. Let me know their
>>>> names or keep them provate. That is okay with me. I am on the
>>>> Board as well as Beth Lapore and Nancy Luthy. So if anyone has
>>>> information you want us to bring up at the Board meeting on
>>>> Monday, let one of us know. My though right now is someone or
>>>> Kat should confront him when he returns. Tell him he is
>>>> welcomed into our community, but his behavior will not be
>>>> tolerated. Well, something like that. Give one of us feedback
>>>> for the meeting and I will share with you what I learned at the
>>>> Board meeting. Chris
>>>> >> From: Maureen <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>>
>>>> >> To: A List <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>>
>>>> >> Cc: Maureen <maureenolander at gmail.com
>>>> <mailto:maureenolander at gmail.com>>
>>>> >> Date: Saturday, 6 February 2021 10:13 AM EST
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [Women] Women's Group Feb. 10
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I have a couple of thoughts based on harassment at my
>>>> workplaces: First, it does no good to mildly rebuke the
>>>> harasser. My first harasser used to ogle and leer whenever I
>>>> approached his desk, which I had to do frequently. He was
>>>> sitting on a high stool (he was a dispatcher) and one day I
>>>> accidentally brushed his crotch area. He started hooting and I
>>>> just snapped. I said very loudly “John, f*** off!” There was
>>>> dead silence in the dispatcher’s room for several minutes. I
>>>> never had a problem again. Make a stink. Be loud. The second
>>>> technique is based on advice to document workplace incidents,
>>>> when, where and what. I wrote a letter to my harasser
>>>> recounting what he did and when and asking him to stop. When
>>>> the time was right I used it with satisfactory results. In all
>>>> my experiences I was harassed by men whom I’d turned down for a
>>>> date or had otherwise hurt their little egos, no matter how
>>>> gently. Remember that these incidents are all about revenge and
>>>> aggression, so respond accordingly. It sounds like we need a UU
>>>> Me Too.
>>>> >> Shalom, Maureen Hope
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Feb 5, 2021, at 9:53 AM, Teresa Hayes via Women
>>>> <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>> wrote:
>>>> >> FYI: This was sent to all of the women's group not to
>>>> Karen or Rebecca alone.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I don't object to this being sent to everyone, but I do want
>>>> to point out that there are two reply arrows that one can use
>>>> on e-mails. The single arrow replies to the person who sent the
>>>> e-mail and the double arrow replies to the entire group, in
>>>> this instance to the women's group. In many cases it's
>>>> important to be sure who you are replying to.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Since it came to everyone, I wanted to offer an opinion.
>>>> It's important for the woman who is being harassed to step into
>>>> her own power and let Paul know his advances are unwanted. I
>>>> know some women do not feel capable of doing this, so it is up
>>>> to each of us who do, to step forward and support our sisters
>>>> until they do feel empowered enough to speak for themselves.
>>>> After all, Paul is not the only man in our community who might
>>>> sexually harass a woman. By community I mean our church
>>>> community, work community, larger community, any community of
>>>> which a woman may be a member.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> So, standing on the side of love for my sisters, I suggest
>>>> we formulate a plan to let Paul know that his advances and
>>>> sexual harassment will not be tolerated. And we need to base
>>>> this upon either existing church policy, or develop a church
>>>> policy that addresses sexual harassment. It really is no more
>>>> difficult than we make it.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> If anyone wishes to reply to me personally about this,
>>>> please feel free to do so. teresa_asselinhayes_2000 at yahoo.com
>>>> <mailto:teresa_asselinhayes_2000 at yahoo.com> or 740-350-6249 On
>>>> Thursday, February 4, 2021, 2:43:14 PM EST, Annie Warmke via
>>>> Women <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>> wrote:
>>>> >> Karen; Here's what I'd like to speak about.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> This has to do with Paul Dunn and his sexual harassment of
>>>> at least four women in the months before he left. It is
>>>> reported that he is returning in a few days so this is very
>>>> worrisome me that women are not safe in our church family. I
>>>> am concerned also because four came forward but how many others
>>>> are there? Initially (July 2019) a man spoke from church spoke
>>>> to me about Paul and asked what to do. I suggested he go to
>>>> the board president and Kat. He did do that but nothing came
>>>> of it.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Now that Paul is returning the man who spoke up is very
>>>> concerned, and spoke to me again. I asked him to talk to Kat
>>>> and the board to find out what our policy is on handling sexual
>>>> harassment. He was told that they would work on it on Monday
>>>> at the board meeting. That made me wonder if there is a
>>>> policy, and if so, why weren't they adhering to it?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I brought the initial report up at the Women's mo. meeting
>>>> in Aug. 2019 and asked what could be done. There was a
>>>> discussion but nothing came of it. I don't feel we should be
>>>> the ones taking the lead on this. It is the men who must step
>>>> up and support the one who initially brought it to everyone's
>>>> attention.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> It is clear something needs to be done before Paul returns.
>>>> Shouldn't we, as a women's group make a statement about sexual
>>>> harassment and how we want it dealt with? I cannot look away.
>>>> Annie
>>>> >> On 2/4/2021 1:33 PM, Karen Binkley via Women wrote:I am
>>>> available to talk if you would like. Karen Binkley
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Feb 4, 2021, at 12:41 PM, Annie Warmke via Women
>>>> <women at fuusm.org <mailto:women at fuusm.org>> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Do you have time for me to call you to talk about a problem
>>>> that, as women, we may want to address? Annie
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On 2/4/2021 11:43 AM, Rebecca Phillips via Women
>>>> wrote:Greetings, women of FUUSM, Just a reminder that our
>>>> monthly meeting will be next Wednesday, February 10, at 7:00
>>>> PM. We will be using the church Zoom link (copied below). Our
>>>> theme is the UU theme of "Side With Love," so please bring an
>>>> example, anecdote, poem, whatever on ways that you/we have
>>>> sided with love for people, animals, the planet. . .
>>>> https://zoom.us/j/94822183499?pwd=ZVhkMHZWSnR1bTI5czZWRk1zdFFmQT09Meeting
>>>> <https://zoom.us/j/94822183499?pwd=ZVhkMHZWSnR1bTI5czZWRk1zdFFmQT09Meeting>
>>>> ID: 948 2218 3499 Passcode: fuusm2323Hope to see you
>>>> then! Rebecca "If you have a garden and a library, you have
>>>> everything you need."-- Cicero
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Women mailing list
>>>> >> Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>>> >> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org>
>>>> >> --
>>>> >> Annie Warmke
>>>> >> Farmer, activist, consultant, writer
>>>> >> Blue Rock Station/Warmke Farm LLC
>>>> >> www.bluerockstation.com <http://www.bluerockstation.com>
>>>> >> (740) 674-4300 or (740) 252-6295 Mobile
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Radio: When the Biomass Hits the Wind Turbine
>>>> >> WOUB Digital Wednesday 9 am
>>>> >> WGRN Digital Friday 11:30 am & Saturday 8:30 am
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Publications:
>>>> >> The Business of Goat Herding (BRS Media)
>>>> >> The Journey Toward Nothing (BRS Media)
>>>> >> Naturally Healthy Goats (BRS Media)
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Podcasts: bluerockstation.com <http://bluerockstation.com>
>>>> >> When the Biomass Hits the Wind Turbine
>>>> >> Arriving at Blue Rock Station
>>>> >>
>>>> >> | | Virus-free. www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com> |
>>>> >>
>>>> >> <annie.vcf
>>>> <http://annie.vcf>>_______________________________________________
>>>> >> Women mailing list
>>>> >> Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>>> >> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Women mailing list
>>>> >> Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>>> >> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org>
>>>> >> --
>>>> >> Annie Warmke
>>>> >> Farmer, activist, consultant, writer
>>>> >> Blue Rock Station/Warmke Farm LLC
>>>> >> www.bluerockstation.com <http://www.bluerockstation.com>
>>>> >> (740) 674-4300 or (740) 252-6295 Mobile
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Radio: When the Biomass Hits the Wind Turbine
>>>> >> WOUB Digital Wednesday 9 am
>>>> >> WGRN Digital Friday 11:30 am & Saturday 8:30 am
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Publications:
>>>> >> The Business of Goat Herding (BRS Media)
>>>> >> The Journey Toward Nothing (BRS Media)
>>>> >> Naturally Healthy Goats (BRS Media)
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Podcasts: bluerockstation.com <http://bluerockstation.com>
>>>> >> When the Biomass Hits the Wind Turbine
>>>> >> Arriving at Blue Rock
>>>> Station_______________________________________________
>>>> >> Women mailing list
>>>> >> Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>>> >>
>>>> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org_______________________________________________
>>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org_______________________________________________>
>>>> >> Women mailing list
>>>> >> Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>>> >> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Women mailing list
>>>> >> Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>>> >> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Women mailing list
>>>> >> Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>>> >> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Women mailing list
>>>> >> Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>>> >> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > Women mailing list
>>>> > Women at fuusm.org <mailto:Women at fuusm.org>
>>>> > http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>>>> <http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Annie Warmke
>>>> Farmer, activist, consultant, writer
>>>> Blue Rock Station/Warmke Farm LLC
>>>> www.bluerockstation.com <http://www.bluerockstation.com>
>>>> (740) 674-4300 or (740) 252-6295 Mobile
>>>>
>>>> Radio: When the Biomass Hits the Wind Turbine
>>>> WOUB Digital Wednesday 9 am
>>>> WGRN Digital Friday 11:30 am & Saturday 8:30 am
>>>>
>>>> Publications:
>>>> The Business of Goat Herding (BRS Media)
>>>> The Journey Toward Nothing (BRS Media)
>>>> Naturally Healthy Goats (BRS Media)
>>>>
>>>> Podcasts: bluerockstation.com <http://bluerockstation.com>
>>>> When the Biomass Hits the Wind Turbine
>>>> Arriving at Blue Rock Station
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>>>> https://www.avg.com <https://www.avg.com>
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>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> Women at fuusm.org
>>>> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> Women mailing list
> Women at fuusm.org
> http://fuusm.org/mailman/listinfo/women_fuusm.org
--
Annie Warmke
Farmer, activist, consultant, writer
Blue Rock Station/Warmke Farm LLC
www.bluerockstation.com
(740) 674-4300 or (740) 252-6295 Mobile
Radio: When the Biomass Hits the Wind Turbine
WOUB Digital Wednesday 9 am
WGRN Digital Friday 11:30 am & Saturday 8:30 am
Publications:
The Business of Goat Herding (BRS Media)
The Journey Toward Nothing (BRS Media)
Naturally Healthy Goats (BRS Media)
Podcasts: bluerockstation.com
When the Biomass Hits the Wind Turbine
Arriving at Blue Rock Station
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